Musings on the new engy gear

[flak dance]

what are peoples opinions on the new engy stuff.

I have found the gunslinger/FJ to work very well on CP maps.  Certainly because turtling was never a valid tactic on these maps, but having teleports was a great boon to the team, so now you can at least providesome additional fire power aswell as improving the teams logistics.

The wrangler i thought looked kick ass on paper, but having used it and been on the recieving end of one it certainly leaves the engy very open to a premature death. The added range/rate of fire is nice but i think its poor substitue for auto aim and freedom to wander off.

Probably be a while before new tactics mature and we see what (if any) balance issues these items introduce.

[Monkeh]

Wrangler engy needs a buddy, simple as.  Then he targets, the shield protects and his buddy repairs the gun.  VERY difficult to take down then.

Shotty is awesome natch and being able to pick up your gun and move it can be used to great effect, ninja behind them and..........death and lots of it.  However he does run very slowly with a level 3 tucked up in his big metal box o' doom.

Basically, a pair of engies with a mixed bag of unlocks will be very hard to take down.  You can even uber an engy when he has his sentry picked up and the gun will stay alive too, simply replace it wherever you like and keep racking up those revenge crits!

[frymaster]

wrangler can be useful (like for attacking someone who's out of detection range) but i wouldn't use it full-time (though there's some possibilities for 2 engies working together)

being able to pick up tele exits is brilliant for CP maps

[Willow]

Wrangler engy needs a buddy, simple as.  Then he targets, the shield protects and his buddy repairs the gun.  VERY difficult to take down then.

But it really isn't. Stickies tend to kill both engineers quite quickly, and then the gun's fucked for three seconds while you finish it off. In some ways the kritzkrieg is more effective against wrangled SGs, just because you only need to kill the engineer(s). Although Uber gives you the advantage of not having to dodge their fail aim.

[Monkeh]

Hmmm, how close does the wrangler engy need to still be in control?  IDK that.  Plus, dont forget the non-wrangler engy will also have a gun of his own, mini or otherwise, that will help with the defence if required.

[Willow]

He has to be reasonably close, close enough that a competant player/team can easily neutralise him. Also for the non-wrangler engy's gun to be effective, it has to be at a specific range so that it will attack you as you go to attack the other gun, instead of picking up a random scout/soldier running past. (Also, you could 'easily' multi-uber a demo and soldier, soldier fucks up normal sg with no engy to repair, demo fucks up wrangler engy and then his gun...)

Ok, ok...that does need a bit more teamwork that is used on a pub server. But then, engy's buddying up with wrangler/non-wrangler pairs also needs more teamwork than usually found on a pub server

[frymaster]

the engy can be as far away as he likes, but the further away from the gun, the harder it is to aim the gun properly, imo (because it's so much easier to aim at a spot out of the gun's line of sight)

[Enef]

The gun always aims at the wall you are looking at. So if you are behind a wall it will be aiming at the wall you are looking at, not the wall in the direction you are looking at. If you get me.


These are all by far my favourite unlocks, to be honest.

[Tikcus]

From a pub stand point, probably doesn't make a shit of a difference what weapon set an engy uses, as 2 players working together can rape an entire pub server anyway. However lets for 1 second assume teamwork exists on a public server

2 engineers working together on (enter random AvD map) wouldn't pose a threat to a competent ubered pair.

Where the wrangler wins, is if someone is shooting the gun beyond the auto fire range (i.e. behind the rocks on dustbowl second stage point 2, with the gun located at bottom left of the cp) engineer switches to wrangler and deals with them.

The mini sentry and wrangler combo are needed to make the mini sentry work, but these i feel will work best on normal push maps, allowing an engy to drop a teleport get to mid, drop a teleport exit, pick up a small box of metal drop a mini sentry and rip through any scouts or teams that don't have a medic (which on a public server is most teams).

From a comp standpoint loads of interesting tactics that the retard admins at etf2l will ban, but the biggest benefit to comp play atm is the ability to move the sentry

[Enef]

Mini sentry + wrangler is fail, the gunslinger is all about getting behind a team, throwing one down as a distraction and moving on to build a tele. It's incredibly useful and deadly if you drop it behind someone whilst they are focused on the cart/point. In all of these situations you need a pistol rather than the wrangler to defend yourself.

[flak dance]

Mini sentry + wrangler is fail, the gunslinger is all about getting behind a team, throwing one down as a distraction and moving on to build a tele. It's incredibly useful and deadly if you drop it behind someone whilst they are focused on the cart/point. In all of these situations you need a pistol rather than the wrangler to defend yourself.

yeah i second this, loadout should be wrangler+wrench OR gunslinger+Pistol - the FJ seems to be alot more suited to the gunslinger setup because of the short life expectancy of the mini SG

On CP maps if you take the wrangler you lose the pistol, and that is pretty vital as its often my primary weapon on many CP maps due to the greater amounts of open space. last thing you want on CP map is to be tethered to your SG. You always want to be near enough to the action to provide dispenser and keep the tele locations useful

But with PL or AD maps that kinda static combat will be more geared towards the bigger SG so wrangler will prove more viable, also these maps usually have me using the pistol far less and the shotgun more due to map choke points promoting fairly close combat. SO the wrangler would more useful.

The mini SG is perfect for what its designed for, that providing the offensive engy with a little supplimental fire power without the loss of mobility


From a point of attacking wrangled SG's its a bit of a mixed bag, i have managed some good kills with the scout as the manual aiming will often give you a good opertunity to supprise the engy before he spots you as he is often distracted. I have even got got the engy between me and his gun twice now and ho shot himself to bits..... that was pretty amusing.

But other times the range on the wrangled SG means the engy can tear up open spaces.

My only gripe so far is the shield should die when the engy dies, not still be active for the 3 secs.

So far im really enjoying this update as engy is my 2nd most played class it been nice to get some new toys.

[Peacekeeper]

2-3 lvl 3 sg's, wrangled by their engies on goldrush stage 1, far in the back (around tunnel to 1st cp, balcony etc). 1 engy to repair etc, placing a mini sg from time to time.
thats a crapload of suppressing fire, i tell ya!

[Tikcus]

Mini sentry + wrangler is fail, the gunslinger is all about getting behind a team, throwing one down as a distraction and moving on to build a tele. It's incredibly useful and deadly if you drop it behind someone whilst they are focused on the cart/point. In all of these situations you need a pistol rather than the wrangler to defend yourself.

forgot you fail to understand it's not an individual game 'Team' Fortress,
mini sentry dies in 1 second without wrangler
You drop sentry, run and hide, change to wrangler get a few assists/kills then rape all will crits
rinse and repeat, but each to his own

[frymaster]

how is running behind the enemy to set up a tele not team play?